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ODT: CONFERENCE TOURNAMENTS 2019

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  • Originally posted by Pollaski View Post

    At the end of the day, its all relative. Texas sucks ass... but there's 300 Division I teams that suck even more ass.
    It's a field size problem, really. The fact that you can limp around all season long like Texas did and still potentially win a national championship isn't whimsical and exciting, it's retarded. I just hope that cancer doesn't spread to college football, but I'm pretty sure it will eventually.

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    • By the way, I fully expect Texas to go on a tear now and make the final four because of how much shit I'm talking about them.

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      • Originally posted by tOSUfanboi2 View Post

        It's a field size problem, really. The fact that you can limp around all season long like Texas did and still potentially win a national championship isn't whimsical and exciting, it's retarded. I just hope that cancer doesn't spread to college football, but I'm pretty sure it will eventually.
        That's part of it. Going from 64-68, and 37 at larges (now 36) did cut the quality. The fact that each year pre-expansion that there was maybe 1 or 2 teams that had a legit argument over being snubbed doesn't help.

        The other is conference consolidation and degredation. I mean, go back to 1999. Here's the conference breakdown for the 64 team field:

        7 Big Ten (11 teams in the conference)
        6 SEC (12)
        5 Big 12 (12)
        5 Big East (13)
        4 Conference USA (12)
        4 Pac-10 (10)
        3 Atlantic 10 (12)
        3 ACC (9)
        3 MVC (10)
        3 WAC (16)
        2 MAC (13)

        You used to have a great many good conferences outside of the Power 6. The A-10, Conference USA, Mountain West, WAC, Missouri Valley- all consistently put at large berths into the field.

        Now? Look at last year

        9 ACC (15)
        8 SEC (14)
        7 Big 12 (10)
        6 Big East (10)
        4 Big Ten (14)
        3 American (12)
        3 Atlantic 10 (14)
        3 Pac-12 (12)
        2 MW (2)

        Notice the difference? We went from 11 conferences sending at-larges, to just 9 (and it would have been 8 had Nevada not bombed out in the MW semis)..


        The A-10 just fell apart, and I don't know why. Maybe ivegostdacityblues can explain what happened, because that conference went to pure ass,even after adding teams that should have vaulted them forward like Davidson and VCU.

        Same with the Mountain West- You went from having legit top-seeds like San Diego State, Nevada, and UNLV, to a 1-bid league that might get 2. (To be fair, the MW gamed the fuck out of the RPI for a few years, and that made them look better than they really were, but that still doesn't explain the drop off). Sure, the Pac-12 snapped up Utah but that can't be the only reason.

        Conference USA's basketball legitimacy imploded when the Big East took all its good teams back in 2006. Now its a shell of its former self.

        The WAC got gutted by the Mountain West, and is now New Mexico State and a bunch of neophytes who have no idea what they're doing.

        The Missouri Valley lost its two biggest members in Creighton and Wichita State, and gained Loyola, who hadn't been relevant for 35 years, and Valpo, literally a one-hit wonder.

        Meanwhile, for whatever reason, the WCC has failed to even come close to catching up to Gonzaga, despite them giving the conference a legit national footprint. What should have been another potential power conference in the making continues to be a mid-major.

        So now, as far as big time college basketball goes, all the top teams are in seven completely bloated conferences. That means all the good teams play each other more and more each year, which naturally drives records down. Meanwhile Gonzaga's over there with a power conference budget stomping on mid-major teams. Add in conferences like the Pac-12 and Big East having incredibly down years, and that just concentrates bids even further into the other 5 (4 really, since the American's getting what it normally does) Outside of that? You're lucky to get one or two true outsiders to sneak through, like Wofford and Buffalo this year, and then maybe a few on the skirts praying to get in. But those tend to win their conference tournaments, and thus the at-large pool continues to remain extremely concentrated.

        Sorry for ranting, but if you want to point to where things have gone wrong, its here.
        Last edited by Pollaski; 03-15-2019, 12:40 AM.

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        • Alright, updated through Day 11. Busiest day of the fortnight- 17 conferences, the vast majority of which run 4 games. Blech.

          Probably the craziest things were Texas Tech losing to WVU, and Old Dominion barely scraping by LaTech.

          Oh yeah, and Nebraska beat Maryland. WTF?

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          • Originally posted by Pollaski View Post

            That's part of it. Going from 64-68, and 37 at larges (now 36) did cut the quality. The fact that each year pre-expansion that there was maybe 1 or 2 teams that had a legit argument over being snubbed doesn't help.

            The other is conference consolidation and degredation. I mean, go back to 1999. Here's the conference breakdown for the 64 team field:

            7 Big Ten (11 teams in the conference)
            6 SEC (12)
            5 Big 12 (12)
            5 Big East (13)
            4 Conference USA (12)
            4 Pac-10 (10)
            3 Atlantic 10 (12)
            3 ACC (9)
            3 MVC (10)
            3 WAC (16)
            2 MAC (13)

            You used to have a great many good conferences outside of the Power 6. The A-10, Conference USA, Mountain West, WAC, Missouri Valley- all consistently put at large berths into the field.

            Now? Look at last year

            9 ACC (15)
            8 SEC (14)
            7 Big 12 (10)
            6 Big East (10)
            4 Big Ten (14)
            3 American (12)
            3 Atlantic 10 (14)
            3 Pac-12 (12)
            2 MW (2)

            Notice the difference? We went from 11 conferences sending at-larges, to just 9 (and it would have been 8 had Nevada not bombed out in the MW semis)..


            The A-10 just fell apart, and I don't know why. Maybe ivegostdacityblues can explain what happened, because that conference went to pure ass,even after adding teams that should have vaulted them forward like Davidson and VCU.

            Same with the Mountain West- You went from having legit top-seeds like San Diego State, Nevada, and UNLV, to a 1-bid league that might get 2. (To be fair, the MW gamed the fuck out of the RPI for a few years, and that made them look better than they really were, but that still doesn't explain the drop off). Sure, the Pac-12 snapped up Utah but that can't be the only reason.

            Conference USA's basketball legitimacy imploded when the Big East took all its good teams back in 2006. Now its a shell of its former self.

            The WAC got gutted by the Mountain West, and is now New Mexico State and a bunch of neophytes who have no idea what they're doing.

            The Missouri Valley lost its two biggest members in Creighton and Wichita State, and gained Loyola, who hadn't been relevant for 35 years, and Valpo, literally a one-hit wonder.

            Meanwhile, for whatever reason, the WCC has failed to even come close to catching up to Gonzaga, despite them giving the conference a legit national footprint. What should have been another potential power conference in the making continues to be a mid-major.

            So now, as far as big time college basketball goes, all the top teams are in seven completely bloated conferences. That means all the good teams play each other more and more each year, which naturally drives records down. Meanwhile Gonzaga's over there with a power conference budget stomping on mid-major teams. Add in conferences like the Pac-12 and Big East having incredibly down years, and that just concentrates bids even further into the other 5 (4 really, since the American's getting what it normally does) Outside of that? You're lucky to get one or two true outsiders to sneak through, like Wofford and Buffalo this year, and then maybe a few on the skirts praying to get in. But those tend to win their conference tournaments, and thus the at-large pool continues to remain extremely concentrated.

            Sorry for ranting, but if you want to point to where things have gone wrong, its here.
            The death of the Big East is really what fucked things up. Just look at the current conference distribution of former members. Does anybody know what conference DePaul is in these days? What about Marquette? UConn?* I'm being a smart ass here, but I really miss that league both as a fan and for what it did to maintain consistency on the east coast. You didn't have to worry as much about whether or not someone in that region was legit because they all played each other AND schedule good out of conference games.

            * Now I'm not 100% sober, but I realized after rereading this post that I actually listed two current "corpse of the Big East" members in my rant. I watch college basketball on a regular basis, and even I can't remember this shit after a few drinks.
            Last edited by tOSUfanboi2; 03-15-2019, 01:15 AM.

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            • Originally posted by tOSUfanboi2 View Post

              The death of the Big East is really what fucked things up. Just look at the current conference distribution of former members. Does anybody know what conference DePaul is in these days? What about Marquette? UConn? I'm being a smart ass here, but I really miss that league both as a fan and for what it did to maintain consistency on the east coast. You didn't have to worry as much about whether or not someone in that region was legit because they all played each other AND schedule good out of conference games.
              Its really funny you said that, because the Big East had a terrible reputation for being overinflated and bombing in the tournament. 2011 was probably the worst- they put a whopping 11 teams in, and the only two to survive the first weekend beat other Big East teams to do it. It got redeemed somewhat when UConn (who finished NINTH in the regular season) stomped all over anyone en route to a Natty.

              And the Big East schedule was a mess. You actually didnt even play every other team in the conference, because if you had, you wouldn't have been able to home and home rivalries.

              That conference breaking up (Syracuse, Louisville, and Pittsburgh went to the ACC, anyone who played football went to the American, and the non-football Catholic schools formed the Big East II) was one of the better things, imo. At the very least, it dropped the at-large berths from 37 to 36.

              I think one of the reason you feel that way is that the new Big East jumped from ESPN to Fox, which isn't exactly the best when it comes to basketball coverage (despite having Gus and Raftery). ESPN gives significantly less coverage to conferences they don't make money off of, and they pretty much shit all over the conference with the "Death of the Big East" 30 for 30. In truth, the Big East didn't die- it just went back to its original intent- a basketball-minded collection of smaller, urban schools (that expanded further west)
              Last edited by Pollaski; 03-15-2019, 01:22 AM.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Pollaski View Post

                Its really funny you said that, because the Big East had a terrible reputation for being overinflated and bombing in the tournament. 2011 was probably the worst- they put a whopping 11 teams in, and the only two to survive the first weekend beat other Big East teams to do it. It got redeemed somewhat when UConn (who finished NINTH in the regular season) stomped all over anyone en route to a Natty.

                And the Big East schedule was a mess. You actually didnt even play every other team in the conference, because if you had, you wouldn't have been able to home and home rivalries.

                That conference breaking up (Syracuse, Louisville, and Pittsburgh went to the ACC, anyone who played football went to the American, and the non-football Catholic schools formed the Big East II) was one of the better things, imo. At the very least, it dropped the at-large berths from 37 to 36.

                I think one of the reason you feel that way is that the new Big East jumped from ESPN to Fox, which isn't exactly the best when it comes to basketball coverage (despite having Gus and Raftery). ESPN gives significantly less coverage to conferences they don't make money off of, and they pretty much shit all over the conference with the "Death of the Big East" 30 for 30.
                People were just salty because the league was great. Look at how many different champions that conference produced over the years and tell me it didn't deserve it's reputation. Checking some numbers, everybody in the conference except South Florida went to at least one final four, and all but three had at least 15 tournament appearances. The haters can bitch all the want, that's impressive.

                I can't remember a year where the two best teams didn't end up playing at least twice. I'm sure it had to have happened, but it's not like it was an epidemic or anything.

                Maybe I'm just bitter because WVU ended up in the Big 12 playing all of their road games over 1000 miles away, but I disagree.

                I just miss Beilein's WVU teams jacking threes and beating east coast teams that can't shoot. I'll get over it.
                Last edited by tOSUfanboi2; 03-15-2019, 01:37 AM.

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                • Well... Zion is back. Now, for the rest of the team to join him.

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                  • Belmont is back in after those bubble implosions last night. HURRAY!

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                    • And now to sadly dash nutt 's hopes...

                      BRACKETEERING 3.15


                      LOCKED: Florida

                      NEAR LOCKED: Minnesota, Ohio State, Seton Hall

                      INTO FIELD: Arizona State

                      OUT OF FIELD: Indiana

                      LAST FOUR BYES: Minnesota (40), Ohio State (41), Seton Hall (42), Clemson (43)

                      LAST FOUR IN: TCU (45), Temple (46), Arizona State (47), Texas (48)

                      WAIT, A 16-16 AT LARGE?: It could happen.

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                      • FUCK YOU I HOPE KANSAS LOSES TO A 13 OR 14 AND UW GETS KNOCKED OUT IN THE PAC-12 SEMIS TONIGHT!

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                        • Originally posted by nutt View Post
                          FUCK YOU I HOPE KANSAS LOSES TO A 13 OR 14 AND UW GETS KNOCKED OUT IN THE PAC-12 SEMIS TONIGHT!
                          Image result for crying hug gif

                          It's okay, man . We're all in this nightmare together.

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                          • I'm trying to figure out how Ohio State is only down 6 at halftime.

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                            • LMFAO if UNC beats Duke again.

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                              • LSU is either going to the Final Four or losing 1st round to a 15 seed.

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