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Threshold Numbers in Sports - NFL Sacks Edition

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  • Threshold Numbers in Sports - NFL Sacks Edition

    What do you guys now consider the cutoff for HoF worthiness in regard to sacks? All-time leader is Bruce Smith with an even 200, so obviously anything above that would qualify, but elite pass rushers like LT "only" had 132.5, placing him at #10 on the all-time list. The active leader is John Abraham with 133.5, so is he a Hall of Famer since his career sacks are higher than LT? I realize it's different positions, but I'm curious what people think about Threshold Numbers for different spots in different sports.
    Here's the career list: http://www.pro-football-reference.co...cks_career.htm
    Here's the active list: http://www.pro-football-reference.co...cks_active.htm I think it's safe to assume guys like Jared Allen and Julius Peppers will likely end up in Canton when they finally hang it up, but what other guys over 100, or on the top 10-20 of that list deserve consideration for the Hall?

    And, go...

  • #2
    It's all relative. If you're getting 10 sacks a year when everyone else is getting 5, then that's more amazing than if you're averaging 15 when everyone else is getting 12.

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    • #3
      This thread really didn't gain much traction...

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      • #4
        So, with Jared Allen going to the Panthers, I figured this was worth revisiting...
        Currently #9 on the all-time sacks list with 134, trailing #7 (tie between Richard Dent & John Randle) by 3.5. Pretty sure we can agree Allen is in, right? If he has a decent season (6-8 sacks), he moves into the top-five, no longer fearing the gap of Michael Strahan. Nearly everyone above Allen, save Jason Taylor, is already in the Hall, with Taylor in strong consideration for the 2017 induction class.

        So, for sacks...Is it safe to use 125 career sacks as a baseline for consideration applied to pass-rush specialists? Derrick Thomas had 126.5, #16 all-time, and after him the Hall members drop off.

        Who reaches 125 before they hang 'em up? Do they rate the Hall? That isn't asking if they're first ballot, rather if they deserve to be in. Keep in mind, #3 on the all-time sacks list still isn't in - Kevin Greene with 160.

        Current players over 125 Sacks (age) based on the links in the OP
        Julius Peppers (35) - 128 (yes, in my opinion)
        DeMarcus Ware (33) - 130.5 (yes)
        Jared Allen (33) - 134 (yes)

        Current players over 100 Sacks (age)
        Terrell Suggs (32) - 106.5
        Robert Mathis (34) - 112

        Current players over 75 Sacks (age)
        Mario Williams (30) - 92
        Elvis Dumervil (31) - 91
        Trent Cole (33) - 85.5
        Shaun Phillips (34) - 81.5
        Tamba Hali (31) - 80.5


        Current young players with a shot at 100 Sacks (age) - Just estimating based on their stats to this point
        J.J. Watt (26) - 60 in 4+ seasons. Best season - 20.5 twice
        Justin Houston (26) - 51.5 4+ seasons. Best season - 22
        Von Miller (26) - 50 in 4+ seasons. Best season - 18.5
        Robert Quinn (25) - 48 in 4+ seasons. Best season - 19
        Aldon Smith (26) - 44 in 4+ seasons. Best season - 19.5


        Just for fun...This year's current leader, Jacquies Smith, has 10.5 in 10 games played, 4 through the first 3 games of this season. Not bad for a guy that couldn't stick with a team until last year with the Bucs. He's 25, but I don't think it's time to crown him just yet. But, this is a message board post, so why not at least mention him..?







        Last edited by Fresneck; 09-30-2015, 01:18 PM.

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        • #5
          It will be a banner day at the Culinary Academy when Jared Allen gets into the HOF. I think he's in.

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          • #6
            LaDainian Tomlinson never played on defense.

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            • #7
              I think Peppers and Ware are in. I think Allen is not.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by RetepAdam View Post
                I think Peppers and Ware are in. I think Allen is not.

                Why not Allen? What more does he need to accomplish to make you happy? What if he plays two more years with a low-ball total of eight sacks each of those years? That puts him right at #4 on the all-time list. He's the all-time leader in safeties, as well...Meaningless stat of the meaningless stats...Four time All-Pro, Five time Pro Bowl. Top five in sacks in the history of the NFL (given the hypothetical)...
                Does he need a couple seasons with double digit sacks to add to his total? Does he need a couple pick sixes?

                I'm just curious why one of the most accomplished pass rushers in the history of the game doesn't belong in the Hall of Fame to you...Again, I'm not saying he's a first ballot guy, but it's hard to think there's a reason to keep him out entirely.

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                • #9
                  It's still retarded the NFL puts a cap on the number of players that can go in each year.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by RetepAdam View Post
                    LaDainian Tomlinson never played on defense.

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                    • #11
                      I dint know what's going on with that gif but I don't like it.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by CheaterMichael View Post
                        I dint know what's going on with that gif but I don't like it.
                        New Jersey and Denver coming together, far as I'm concerned.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Fresneck View Post


                          Why not Allen? What more does he need to accomplish to make you happy? What if he plays two more years with a low-ball total of eight sacks each of those years? That puts him right at #4 on the all-time list. He's the all-time leader in safeties, as well...Meaningless stat of the meaningless stats...Four time All-Pro, Five time Pro Bowl. Top five in sacks in the history of the NFL (given the hypothetical)...
                          Does he need a couple seasons with double digit sacks to add to his total? Does he need a couple pick sixes?

                          I'm just curious why one of the most accomplished pass rushers in the history of the game doesn't belong in the Hall of Fame to you...Again, I'm not saying he's a first ballot guy, but it's hard to think there's a reason to keep him out entirely.
                          I looked at his PFR page after making that post and was surprised that he was a 4-time All-Pro.

                          I don't know. He just never felt like as dominant a player in his prime as the other two. But the numbers suggest he was and that he will get in, so I'm probably just wrong on this one.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by RetepAdam View Post

                            I looked at his PFR page after making that post and was surprised that he was a 4-time All-Pro.

                            I don't know. He just never felt like as dominant a player in his prime as the other two. But the numbers suggest he was and that he will get in, so I'm probably just wrong on this one.

                            I think it might have to do with him playing for mediocre Chefs teams for a while (even though, I know you're a Broncos fan and probably saw more of him than you'd prefer) and then seemed somewhat overshadowed by the interior DL and LBs during many of his years in Minnesota. Even when he had 22 sacks in 2011, it still didn't seem to register on the national scale the way J.J. Watt or Justin Houston have in the past couple years. Maybe going 3-13 had something to do with that...

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                            • #15
                              Here is the problem with using a threshold.

                              Robert Mathis might make the HofF. That is fucking disgusting. This guy was never ever ever considered a top pass rusher in any of his NFL seasons. I'm actually shocked he has 112 career sacks.

                              He had 1 season with more than 12 sacks and that was at age 32 while he was on "PEDs" (save the fertility treatment argument, its bogus as shit).

                              There is no fucking way Mathis is a HofF.

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